coon's age

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coon's age

Post by hsargent » Fri Apr 13, 2007 1:29 pm

It's been a coon's age since I took a Math Test!
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coon's age

Post by gdwdwrkr » Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:18 pm

"I can say it but you can't": "I have a dream...".
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coon's age

Post by Wizard of Oz » Fri Apr 13, 2007 6:50 pm

.. James I wonder which speech writer actually wrote those lines ?? .. naturally we will be told that MLK wrote ALL his own material just like all those other famous speech makers ..
Shelley wrote:

As I've said before -- IT'S ALL ABOUT INTENTION and, of course, the unwritten "I can say it but you can't" law, which is totally legit in my book. I'm really losing patience with those who complain about its imagined inequity.
.. and Shelley I am likewise losing patience with those people who think they have some kind of holy writ to tell me what words I can and can't use simply based on THEIR beliefs and not on MY culture .. and to me the inequity isn't imagined it is very real .. oh damn .. now I am going to be some sort of -ist again .. oh well I have broad shoulders and it's Ok to call me anything you like because I am designated as having no definable culture or heritage or sad sorry tale of deprivation and dispossesion .. isn't that how it works ?? ..

WoZ of Aus 14/04/07
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coon's age

Post by nettie » Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:26 pm

I do agree "in theory" to the all about intention theory, but let's be realistic. What are the intentions of anyone when they call women hoes (leaving the n word aside) Would anyone who utters the word hoe like it to be said about their wife, sister, cousin, friend-or face it anyone they hold in respect or decency. The n word appears to have different rules-blacks say they can use it because-well I don't know for everyone, but in children you get remarkable candour, and in those I have spoken to is because just because---meaning they don't mean anything by it-it just is. That I get. The white people I have spoken with (sorry but it is the only other racial group I have spoken to about this-read-my town has black and white for the most part) They don't really use hoe as but they sure as heck use the "n" word. Their excuse-There are black people who are n"s and white people who are white trash or trailer trash blah blah blah....Sorry, but most of the white people who say this would be by their own definition white trash. What an insult to the miracle of life that we should diminish it to trash of any kind. While I am not religious, I at least feel somewhat spiritual at some times, I think we owe it to each other to at least think about what we say and how it may make someone feel whether intended or not.
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coon's age

Post by nettie » Fri Apr 13, 2007 7:49 pm

P.S. While on the latest census I checked white, my classroom has been working on another color spectrum. We started with black and white and decided that included very few if any of us. Remember they are only 7 and 8 so their knowledge of color words is somewhat limited. We started with white and went from their-here it is so far, but it is only a work in progress. We started with white, but when no one actually knew anyone the color of a white crayon we moved on to sort of white, kinda of white, peaches, tannish, yellowish, red, freckled, coffee, creamy, brown, lightish brown, black, really black, kind of black-well too bad we aren't all children.
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coon's age

Post by Shelley » Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:20 pm

One . . . two . . . three . . . four . . . five . . . six . . . seven . . . eight . . . nine . . . ten . . . . . . . . . ten . . .
. . . . . . ten . . .

At the risk of prolonging this outright, off-topic agony -- I need some clarification, gd.

The relationship between "I can say it but you can't" and "I have a dream" eludes me. Are you saying that applying the ICSIBYC principle to Martin Luther King, Jr.'s wonderful speech makes it impossible for us all to share his dream? Or are you saying the ICSIBYC principle is working in this country to betray his (our) dream? Or are you pointing out that the two concepts are mutually exclusive? No big deal, I just don't get it.

WoZ, this is a road more travelled than expected. As you know, I accept this name-calling double standard. (You're right -- imagined inequity is wrong.) It does not make me a victim. I don't know about your life, but mine is FILLED with double-standards, some of them very hard to take! This one is a piece o' cake, because it doesn't even occur to me to WANT to call someone a 'ho'. "Sex worker" is better, don't you think? (That got you, I bet -- I can hear you screaming, WoZ! You have got to get a sense of humor about this stuff.)

Look, nobody ever said it was gonna be easy: it remains a dream, but maybe little by little, generation after generation, the dream will become reality and perhaps then everyone will strive to make the “content of their character” excellent (as well as their spelling, grammar, and math skills). It takes these public episodes of extreme unconsciousness on the part of knuckleheads of all colors to remind us how bad it is and how far we have to go. Entropy is law. Chaos is king. It takes constant vigilance to hold up the foundation for "can't we all just get along?" I, for one, want to use my energies to build it up, Buttercup Baby, not to let it down.

I agree wholeheartedly with you about the prohibition on speech. Short of crying fire in a crowded theatre, you can say anything you want to. Anybody can say anything they want to. With that freedom comes the obligation to own your speech, including the consequences of it. No good pointing to the other guy crying, "Well, gee, he said it first!" Horrible things have been uttered in the name of free speech, and will continue to be spewed by dungeon-heads of all colors, shapes and sizes. Name-calling is the very least of it. There are some things I hear in public that I have no sense of humor about at all.

You say you have broad shoulders, WoZ. This must be the cross you have to bear. May it be the only one.

P.S. I'm really scared to post this -- don't everybody smack me upside the head all at once, now.
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coon's age

Post by nettie » Fri Apr 13, 2007 11:24 pm

I was with you sort of until you felt the need to mention ones grammar, math and spelling skills. don't you see that people with opinions and feelings that need to bre heard because they are afraid they will be riducled by the language police. Do you want to hear what they are feeling or do you wish they not only had spell check but verb tense usage check?
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coon's age

Post by gdwdwrkr » Sat Apr 14, 2007 1:24 am

My point, Shelley, is that even quoting the wonderful words of Martin Luther King's speech, and sincerely meaning them is received with the double-standard. Not by the color of your skin, but by the content of your character.
ICSIBYC does betray the dream. It is the outflow of severely-flawed character.
Those with integrity of character who can S ICSIBYC do not SI.
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coon's age

Post by Erik_Kowal » Sat Apr 14, 2007 5:37 am

Nettie, my interpretation of Shelley's remarks concerning spelling, grammar and mathematics was that she looked forward to a time when people would value things that were not trashy over those that were. She does not seem to me to be saying that people with less-than-perfect grammar do not deserve to be heard.

Anyway, this topic reminds me of a recent radio discussion (listen to it online here) on NPR involving Cora Daniels, the author of Ghettonation: A Journey into the Land of Bling and Home of the Shameless. She defines "ghetto" as a mindset, not just a type of neighbourhood, and thinks it's not necessarily a good thing.
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coon's age

Post by Edwin Ashworth » Sat Apr 14, 2007 2:06 pm

Correct spelling is undervalued. There are Grammar Schools, Schools of Mathematics, but you hear about a Spelling School less than once every Preston Guild.
Unless you include the non-muggle variety.
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coon's age

Post by gdwdwrkr » Sat Apr 14, 2007 3:03 pm

Our public schools, at least throughout the 80s, encouraged "invented spelling", and feelings, above all.
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coon's age

Post by hsargent » Sat Apr 14, 2007 3:18 pm

[quote]Originally posted by Wizard of Oz
.. James I wonder which speech writer actually wrote those lines ?? .. naturally we will be told that MLK wrote ALL his own material just like all those other famous speech makers .. [quote]

I actually know the answer about the MLK quote.

His speech writers we told to rewrite what they had provided. They stayed up till 2 AM with a new version.

The I had a dream was not any any of the prepared text. He was winging it.
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coon's age

Post by gdwdwrkr » Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:12 pm

Writers can concoct fine-sounding words 'til we're blue in the face. Truth spoken from the heart lives and grows.
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coon's age

Post by gdwdwrkr » Sat Apr 14, 2007 4:20 pm

Shelley wrote:

P.S. I'm really scared to post this -- don't everybody smack me upside the head all at once, now.
Please never fear speaking the truth, or asking a question. I know you know this. I have deleted more posts (pre-posting, thank you Jesus) this week than ever before. But if you shut it up in your bones, they will catch fire.
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Post by nettie » Sun Apr 15, 2007 12:30 am

I don't really feel this off topic discussion is agony-but I do see that there seems a need to continue in another forum-or maybe not-why can't we discuss something just because it has branched off from the original discussion. Isn't this where most great observations are made? It is not as instant as a verbal discussion, but maybe that gives one time to comtimplate one's reply-or not-but at least you do have that time before you press send, whereas once out of your mouth you are doomed.
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