A dove diving

This is the place to post questions and discussions on usage and style. The members of the Wordwizard Clubhouse will also often be able to help you to formulate that difficult letter.
Post Reply

A dove diving

Post by Bobinwales » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:53 pm

In her post about the strangeness of the English language,
http://www.wordwizard.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?t=18867
Krystal included:
"When shot at, the dove dove into the bushes."

We don’t use “dove” in the UK, there seems to be a preference for “dived”, are there comments from around the world on this?
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS
Signature: All those years gone to waist!
Bob in Wales

A dove diving

Post by Shelley » Tue Mar 28, 2006 4:20 pm

Yes, Bobinwales. "The sun shone" versus "the sun shined" has bothered me, as well as "dived" v. "dove". There must be dozens of these: weaved v. wove; awakened v. awoken. As soon as I do a little work (I am on the job, after all!), I'll do a WW search to see if any of this has been discussed before.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by russcable » Tue Mar 28, 2006 7:17 pm

The issue is strong verbs (sing, sang) vs. weak verbs (laugh, laughed) from Old English/German grammar. Through usage, over-generalization, asd similarities to words of the other type, the usage may stray from the original "correct" one. For example, with dive and drive, (I think) the "correct" past tenses should be dived and drove, but the words are so similar that a lot of us end up using dove instead of dived.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by Edwin Ashworth » Tue Mar 28, 2006 7:39 pm

I hope you'll blame the language rather than me, but the past tense of "drove" (to drive geese, etc - rare nowadays) is "droved". It's enough to - er - render you mad.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by Ken Greenwald » Tue Mar 28, 2006 10:44 pm

Hmm. This discussion provides a whole new slant on “Three French hens, Two turtles dove, And a partridge . . .”

And, of course, now we have a better understanding of that term we hear so often in diving competitions when the foot is pointed just so upon entry - "dover's sole."
_____________________

Garner’s Modern American Usage offers the following:

DIVE>DIVED>DIVED. Although dove is fairly common in American English (on the analogy of drove), dived is the predominant—and the preferable form.
_____________________

Ken G – March 28, 2006

[P.S. I use both but never realized it. I would say 'He dived off the bridge' but 'He dove for cover' and I'm not sure why!
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by minjeff » Wed Mar 29, 2006 4:41 pm

If we want to be this pedantic then technically the past tense of "work" is "wrought" (same for the participle). However, while this is my favorite form, many people merely look at you in amazement when such flies forth from one's lips.

And by the way every time I right one of those papers about my goals I'm always confused as to whether one should say "strove" or "strived" (personally I like "strove").

And to retort Ken: I hear/see "dove" more often then dived.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS
Signature: Letters go together to make words; words go together to make phrases, and phrases sentences, but only in certain combinations. In others they're just non-sense.

A dove diving

Post by Shelley » Wed Mar 29, 2006 4:54 pm

So, minjeff, if I wanted to say, "I worked on that project", you're suggesting I could say, "I wrought on that project"? Sounds weird to me, unless I'm missing something.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by minjeff » Wed Mar 29, 2006 6:08 pm

Yes I am suggesting that because "wrought" used to be the accepted past tense of work. It's similar in structure to bring/brought, teach/taught, buy/bought, seek/sought.

Although depending on how high a grammar standard one has "teach" could be "teached" ;-)
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS
Signature: Letters go together to make words; words go together to make phrases, and phrases sentences, but only in certain combinations. In others they're just non-sense.

A dove diving

Post by tony h » Wed Mar 29, 2006 10:37 pm

I use both dove and dived. I use worked normally but wrought in craftsmanship (particularly metals) eg : wrought-iron; finely wrough silver; wrought in leather. Maybe worked is your effort and wrought is what you do to materials?
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS
Signature: tony

I'm puzzled therefore I think.

A dove diving

Post by gdwdwrkr » Wed Mar 29, 2006 11:09 pm

worker worked
wright wrought
wright?
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by Ken Greenwald » Thu Mar 30, 2006 6:14 am

What hath God worked? - I don't like it! (&lt)
_____________________

Ken G - March 29, 2006
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

A dove diving

Post by Edwin Ashworth » Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:37 am

I was about to query whether "wrought" was the past tense of "wreak" rather than "work" but thankfully checked first; at http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/index.p ... e=20000404 there is a good treatment of this topic.
At http://www.englishpage.com/irregularverbs/window2.html there is a comprehensive (?) list of irregular English verbs.
ACCESS_POST_ACTIONS

ACCESS_END_OF_TOPIC
Post Reply