Questions about words related to religions "dietary laws".

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Questions about words related to religions "dietary laws".

Post by JANE DOErell » Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:25 pm

I've some questions about words related to "dietary law" in Judaism and Islam.

We outsiders refer to the food conforming to dietary laws of the Jews as "Kosher". Presumably some "Rabbi" determines what is kosher and what is not. What words do persons practicing Judaism use for kosher and the Rabbi who does this sort of thing?

What are the corresponding foods and persons called in Islam?
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Post by zmjezhd » Sun Dec 09, 2007 10:39 pm

Hebrew kashrut,an abstract noun derived from the adjective kasher 'fit'. Non-kosher foods are called in Hebrew trephah (in Yiddish treif). The rules come from the Torah (first five books of the Old Testament) as codified in the Shulchan Arukh (literally, the 'set table', 16th century CE). Some rules differ between Sephardic and Ashkenazic branches of Judaism: e.g., how long after ingesting meat can somebody eat dairy, or vice versa. Some foods (e.g., pork or lobster) are categorically treif, and others are made so by improper preparation, handling, etc. For Islam, there is a term halal Arabic for 'permitted'. Some foods are forbidden haraam (English harem is from the same root). Also, preparation or slaughter (as with kashruth) can make certain foods invalid: e.g., roadkill is right out, game is forbidden in kashruth if shot, because the skin must be without blemish. You might want to read up more about it in the Jewish Encyclopedia.

[Corrected misspelling.]
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Post by JANE DOErell » Thu Dec 13, 2007 4:25 pm

What are the words related or analogous in nature, character, or function to Kosher and Rabbi in Islam?

Other religions?
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Post by Shelley » Thu Dec 13, 2007 5:01 pm

"Halal" is the word in Arabic which applies to food that is in compliance with dietary laws.
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Post by russcable » Thu Dec 13, 2007 5:17 pm

As Jim mentioned above, halal is roughly equivalent to kashrut/kosher. I wouldn't risk trying to relate to any clergical hierarchies.

This is a huge kettle of fish (but not shellfish) that you're asking to be opened...

Kosher meat is slaughtered by a trained shochet using a special knife called a chalef. To be glatt kosher, the the lungs must be inspected by a bodek to determine that there are few or no sirkas (adhesions), if there are no adhesions it can be considered "Beit Yosef". Poultry that has been held to a high standard (menhadrin) is sometimes also referred to as being glatt kosher even though it isn't subject to the same requirements. Then the removal of the veins, blood, sciatic nerve and other prohibited parts is called treiboring or nikkur and is performed by a Menaker. And...

I don't know what any of the Islamic equivalents are to all that if there are any.
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Post by Shelley » Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:06 pm

The Muslim who happens to be standing right next to me at the moment tells me "imam" is the corresponding title in Islam to "rabbi" in Judaism. These are the religions' words for "teacher" or "leader". In Catholicism, it's "priest", Protestants say "minister", Hindus - "guru", Buddhists - "sensei" (for a teacher of martial arts), Scientologists -- well, I'm not sure: I know they have "auditors".
Jane, there must be dozens of these different corresponding religious titles. I'd be curious to know more of them, too, even if they are not in English! ;^)
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Post by jeffreys » Wed Jan 02, 2008 1:05 pm

Non-kosher foods are called in Hebrew trephah (in Yiddish treif)
[Corrected misspelling.]
Not quite.
TREIF means 'torn'. It applies to limb severed from living animal or to an animal incorrectly killed even by a trained shochet (e.g. if knife is not ultra-sharpened and smooth-bladed so the artery is unevenly cut).
Hence a pig- for instance- cannot literally be 'treif'; it could never have been kosher in the first place.
The true oposite of 'kosher' is TAMEI (= impure).
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Post by Berale » Thu Jan 03, 2008 3:08 pm

Hmmm... I'm an Israeli and we do not use the word "tameh" in the context of food. In current Israeli usage the Hebrew word "trephah" is used to mean non-kosher (or the yiddish "treif").
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Post by gdwdwrkr » Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:30 pm

Do Israelis use "impure" in reference to anything? I mean, no one walks the streets shouting "unclean" anymore do they? Where is the line drawn? Of course, I guess it is sect-related.
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Post by Berale » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:45 pm

Thanks for the laugh, James. I can just imagine people going around the streets shouting "unclean, unclean" - mind you, there are some extreme Orthodox in Jerusalem who throw stones at cars on the Sabbath and spit at girls dressed immodestly by their standards, so perhaps this isn't so far-fetched...

Seriously though, I can't really think of any everyday context in which we would use the word "impure" these days. Though there are plenty of occasions which would merit it in my view. We have become a very unholy nation, I'm afraid.
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Post by Berale » Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:19 pm

Berale wrote: Hmmm... I'm an Israeli and we do not use the word "tameh" in the context of food. In current Israeli usage the Hebrew word "trephah" is used to mean non-kosher (or the yiddish "treif").
Having said that, "tameh" is indeed the term used in the Bible to describe animals that we aren't allowed to eat. It's just not currently used in that sense to the best of my knowledge, but it may be that amongst the very strict observers of kashrut the terminology is different.
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Post by Berale » Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:49 pm

And I've looked up "trefa" and indeed in the Bible it's used in the sense of an animal that has been torn by beasts and is therefore unfit for eating, but in modern Hebrew it's used in the sense of any food ritually unfit for eating.
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Post by jeffreys » Thu Jan 17, 2008 5:27 pm

gdwdwrkr wrote: Do Israelis use "impure" in reference to anything? I mean, no one walks the streets shouting "unclean" anymore do they? Where is the line drawn? Of course, I guess it is sect-related.
Are you a sects-maniac, then?
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Post by gdwdwrkr » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:10 pm

Aren'tjew?
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